March 27, 2012 at 1:50 am #28529
I think there will be, because it’s more widespread than Cantonese. Granted, you may get a few looks and get pushed around a bit in Cantonese-speaking areas (I heard), but at least you can get your point across.
It sure is, but I personally don’t think one can be completely fluent (as in native-level speaking) in a second language. It’s a bit hypocritical, considering what I told you four posts back, but that’s what I think.March 28, 2012 at 2:38 am #28643
That’s good to know. I think my main concern if I knew Mandarin and Cantonese would be getting them mixed up or using an incorrect tone. Mandarin will definitely surge in popularity in the future.
The subject of fluency is interesting. My definition of fluency is not necessarily about how much vocabularly you know, but more to do with grammar. How sentences are structured, rules, use of verbs, adjectives, nouns, etc. Vocabularly can be picked up any time, but if you understand and know how to use grammar correctly, you will find it alot easier learning a language and maybe one day reaching the level of a native speaker. Of course, reaching a level of a native speaker takes years. When learning our native language, we are fully immersed in it 24/7 and pick up things naturally without intentionally learning about them.
Knowing alot of vocabularly does help alot too. They both fit in with each other.
I’d be happy just knowing enough of the languages I want to learn to use in day to day life.March 28, 2012 at 5:01 am #28647
Depends what your definition of fluent is. I consider that when you can speak about any topic with a high level of understanding and competence, that is definitely achievable.March 28, 2012 at 5:03 am #28648
I think if you’re sincere and not intentionally messing things up, people won’t really mind if you get a word or two wrong. Depends on the situation though.
Interesting points you have there, I agree that proper use of grammar goes a long way in proving your fluency. When I read some English posts by Japanese users on Lang-8, the thing that usually confuses me most is not the wrong spelling, but the errors in grammar. It takes a while if they’ve spelling errors to figure it out, but if the grammar’s correct, I can get the point easily.
On another point, I think fluency depends on your aspirations or the situations you’ll most likely find yourself in. If you’re a high-level diplomat, you’re going to have to brush up on stuff way more than the average businessman. But for now, I think I’ll just settle with day-to-day conversations like you said, and learn what I need to learn when the time comes.March 28, 2012 at 5:16 am #28649
Exactly! I don’t think there’s any shame in saying you are fluent but still making mistakes from time to time, that is always going to happen. Even in your native language. :PMarch 29, 2012 at 3:40 am #28671
@Yggbert: I think I can relate to that…But still, some people aren’t as forgiving of mistakes, like Grammar Nazis for example. I really dislike people who nitpick over the smallest thing.March 29, 2012 at 5:51 am #28676
I agree with you both when you say it depends on a persons aspirations, goals and situations they will find themselves in, that determines a level of fluency. Situations such as being able to read shop signs, menus, talking with the natives, and writing/typing are all definitely acheivable when learning a second language/subsequent languges.
Reading classical texts or teaching a class in another language will definitely be harder and require a higher level of fluency.
I think we all make mistakes with grammar and spelling, even in our native language. When I write an official document, I always use spell check to check over my spelling and grammar.
When I speak to people who aren’t native English speakers, I’m very forgiving on spelling mistakes and grammer errors. As long as I can make out what they’re trying to say either written or spoken, I don’t mind too much.April 15, 2012 at 4:33 pm #29377
Malaysian! My ex was from Melasia. Petaling Jaya area. I spent a total of 6 months there and adored every second. I was hoping to move there one day, but I don’t think fate has it in my cards in the immediate future. I miss Mee Goreng and Roti Boom. :(
To get back on topic, I’ve taken both Japanese and Chinese (a semester each) and they do help each other out a lot. The tones can be a pain, but I promise you… once you spend some time with it, it’s really easy.
In an unrelated item, has anyone found a site like this for Chinese? I know one for Korean was posted recently.
April 15, 2012 at 8:34 pm #29384
- This reply was modified 11 years, 8 months ago by Dariath.
Probably go for Chinese since they have an Official AKB store in Hong Kong and are going to create Taipei48 (god forbid).
But more seriously, I would have to guess that Korean would be so much easier after learning Japanese so I’d like to dabble in that if I become fluent in JapaneseApril 15, 2012 at 11:04 pm #29388
Haven’t come across a Chinese equivalent of TextFugu yet. Will let you know if I do.
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